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Discussion Starter #1
Hi everyone,

I need to replace my spark plugs for the 15k mile service soon.
The NGK recommended part is NGK PFR7G with .8mm gap . However due to shortage of supply, it seems some have used the NGK PFR7G-11S with 1.1mm gap.

Is using plug which is not set at factory gap value going to cause issues along the way ?
Has anyone had problems with 11S ? Do you re-gap to the correct measure or use as it ?

I will checking with my mechanic too but wanted to hear experience of those using 11S too
 

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I'm surprised no one has commented on this in 2 weeks. I wouldn't want to be left hanging on a question like that, but maybe by now you got an answer from your mechanic/tech?
I personally would not choose to run a gap larger than factory spec as that is pretty much the equivalent of putting very old spark plugs in. The ones in your car might not even be worn to that gap yet...... In a situation like that where you had no choice I would absolutely re-gap those plugs to the .8mm
The ONLY time I would deviate from factory spec on plug gap would be after engine / performance modifications. Good example, turbo or supercharged applications usually involve shortening the gap to prevent spark extinguish 'blow-out' from forced induction. There are those that say slightly increasing the plug gap on normally aspirated engines can yield small Hp gains and fuel economy but that is suggested for lower compression engines. Don't think we fit into that category here !! Doing so also taxes the ignition system demanding extra power to jump the larger gap and increases the chance for misfire. That's where Jacob's and MSD ignitions shine on our old Classics
To sum it up, when you get misfires the first thing you do is a tune-up spark plug change because old plugs have potentially larger gaps than new ones (among other things). Last thing you want to do is put in plugs with larger gaps than factory specified unless you have a specific helpful reason for doing so
 
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Discussion Starter #3
I'm surprised no one has commented on this in 2 weeks. I wouldn't want to be left hanging on a question like that, but maybe by now you got an answer from your mechanic/tech?
I personally would not choose to run a gap larger than factory spec as that is pretty much the equivalent of putting very old spark plugs in. The ones in your car might not even be worn to that gap yet...... In a situation like that where you had no choice I would absolutely re-gap those plugs to the .8mm
The ONLY time I would deviate from factory spec on plug gap would be after engine / performance modifications. Good example, turbo or supercharged applications usually involve shortening the gap to prevent spark extinguish 'blow-out' from forced induction. There are those that say slightly increasing the plug gap on normally aspirated engines can yield small Hp gains and fuel economy but that is suggested for lower compression engines. Don't think we fit into that category here !! Doing so also taxes the ignition system demanding extra power to jump the larger gap and increases the chance for misfire. That's where Jacob's and MSD ignitions shine on our old Classics
To sum it up, when you get misfires the first thing you do is a tune-up spark plug change because old plugs have potentially larger gaps than new ones (among other things). Last thing you want to do is put in plugs with larger gaps than factory specified unless you have a specific helpful reason for doing so
Thanks a lot for the information and details.
I originally got the 11S which seems to be common choice here and people have had good experience with.

I spoke to my mechanic also , he mentioned since the heat rate is the same and coils are capable of handling the gap size difference it wouldn’t cause an issue. Strongly recommended not to regap platinum plugs as in most cases can cause fine cracks.

However I found NGK with the right pre gapped size which I will buy instead
 

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Strongly recommended not to regap platinum plugs as in most cases can cause fine cracks.

However I found NGK with the right pre gapped size which I will buy instead
Yes, he's Absolutely right about re-gapping platinum plugs, good move on the NGK. Still thinking about the last job I did using Autolite standards in an old supercharged V8
 

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Discussion Starter #5
Yes, he's Absolutely right about re-gapping platinum plugs, good move on the NGK. Still thinking about the last job I did using Autolite standards in an old supercharged V8
So have you tested the 11S on your or any other pre LP Gallardo and had negative result ? I’m just keen to know how others having a positive outcome changing to 11S whilst in theory it should be the opposite
 

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No, research would confirm or deny that (long term), someone who Has used them for a substantial length of time/miles. Initially the wider gap could show positive results in the form of throttle response and gas mileage. I'd have my doubts as to how many miles you could get before the positive effects start to degrade (it could shorten the service interval). If NGK has the same heat range interchange equivalent to the PFR7G gapped @ .8mm I would prefer that over using a 1.1mm gap. Hey, I haven't checked, but if people are using the 11s and having great results... by all means, I'd do it too if my homework reveals that all is good. Find out if any of those people had any coil issues / having to replace coils maybe not long after the change. The larger gap will make the coils 'work harder than required before' and could expose the weak one, or two. That's some of the theory of it. Ultimately you make your best decision based on the info and research you do. I hoped that helped and didn't make it more confusing !!
 

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Discussion Starter #7
No, research would confirm or deny that (long term), someone who Has used them for a substantial length of time/miles. Initially the wider gap could show positive results in the form of throttle response and gas mileage. I'd have my doubts as to how many miles you could get before the positive effects start to degrade (it could shorten the service interval). If NGK has the same heat range interchange equivalent to the PFR7G gapped @ .8mm I would prefer that over using a 1.1mm gap. Hey, I haven't checked, but if people are using the 11s and having great results... by all means, I'd do it too if my homework reveals that all is good. Find out if any of those people had any coil issues / having to replace coils maybe not long after the change. The larger gap will make the coils 'work harder than required before' and could expose the weak one, or two. That's some of the theory of it. Ultimately you make your best decision based on the info and research you do. I hoped that helped and didn't make it more confusing !!
Thanks again. Everything you mentioned makes sense. It all comes down to what coils are capable of and if the larger gap as you stated puts more strain on them, or the difference is still within the acceptable load on them.

probably need some technical data comparison to know for sure . See if/when running the larger gap demands beyond the safe threshold of the coils.
In a post someone mentioned since champion is copper and NGK platinum , larger gap is needed for platinum to provide better performance. Need to research this and find the validity.

if anyone has been using the 11S for long period of time please let us know your experience and if faced any issues
 

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I dont have time right now to elaborate a ton, but there is a lot of misinformation on these forums about spark plugs. Lots of threads from people who have no clue what they're talking about recommending plugs that run way too hot.

The correct spark plugs are the following: NGK R PFR76

That is verifiably, objectively, surely, the correct spark plug for this car. That is what you should be running. The 11S will work, the car will run, but it isnt ideal. I'm sure some armchair mechanics will disagree, but the above spark plug is the correct match and what should be in everyones car. They should be paired with 07K905715F ignition coils but will also work with the 07K905715F coils in early cars.
 

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Discussion Starter #9
I dont have time right now to elaborate a ton, but there is a lot of misinformation on these forums about spark plugs. Lots of threads from people who have no clue what they're talking about recommending plugs that run way too hot.

The correct spark plugs are the following: NGK R PFR76

That is verifiably, objectively, surely, the correct spark plug for this car. That is what you should be running. The 11S will work, the car will run, but it isnt ideal. I'm sure some armchair mechanics will disagree, but the above spark plug is the correct match and what should be in everyones car. They should be paired with 07K905715F ignition coils but will also work with the 07K905715F coils in early cars.
Thanks for your input .
I am not looking at any different type ( heat or material ) than the same series as OEM NGK should be.

however I’m curious to know if there is a formula to calculate the load on the coil packs and ignition equipment which would show how much it would increase from .8mm ( OEM) to 1.1mm gap on 11S and if that’s outside of the safe zone for them.

would that actually put any strain on the electrical system or it will be fine ?

I agree with lots of misinformation or assumption without any scientific backend, so I’m keen to hear from those with accurate knowledge about it.
 

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How about NGK R PFR7G ? stock# 4364
(make the 'G' a 6 then add Lambo tax) LAMBORGHINI 400 905 619
apparently they come gapped correctly at .8mm
specifications: PFR7G

People who say it ok to run a 1.1mm gap when factory spec. calls for .8mm are probably the same people who say it's ok to use 87 octane fuel when it says right on the fuel door to use 91+ ....... and then wonder why sometime down the road they have to replace a head gasket.
 

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Discussion Starter #11
How about NGK R PFR7G ? stock# 4364
(make the 'G' a 6 then add Lambo tax) LAMBORGHINI 400 905 619
apparently they come gapped correctly at .8mm
specifications: PFR7G

People who say it ok to run a 1.1mm gap when factory spec. calls for .8mm are probably the same people who say it's ok to use 87 octane fuel when it says right on the fuel door to use 91+ ....... and then wonder why sometime down the road they have to replace a head gasket.
Yep that’s the one .
The right and OEM approved . 11S is not and sadly suppliers say it is and people believe them.

what people miss is with larger gap you need higher voltage to create the right spark . Meaning higher load on the coils. However if the coils and ignition have the threshold of extra load then it’s fine . However I’m still trying to find out if they do and if using 11S reaches the limit or not . It’s more for my own curiosity than anything , and perhaps helping others to make a right decision
 

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I have No affiliation with any of those links, there for reference only. I didn't check but you can probably find them cheaper somewhere else............
 

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Discussion Starter #13
NGK were out of stock for a long time of these plugs so many start buying 11S and NGK never claimed they are right for our cars.

again all comes down to if 11S and larger gap would have noticeable downsides in short or long term or it is fine and not very noticeable as it’s the same series and heat rating as the original plugs
 
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