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Discussion Starter · #1 · (Edited)
Finally I got my car running, but not the damned tacho.
It's interesting that almost all Countach have no problems, but the Jalpa do.

Some were able to fix it with a tacho adapter of MSD, but some others (like mine) are not willing...

As on the Countach there is also the possibility to install the Permatune unit.
Refer to my website to get more info:
http://www.jalpa.ch/Ignition/index.html

The way to fix this problem is to change the circuit of the tacho, Fred did this by sending the tacho to Paolo Alto tachometers.
I have also a company here in Switzerland, I think we go to them with 2 Jalpas to find out the difference in the signal, perhaps they can produce an own tacho adapter...
 

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Raymond,

Did you change your Permatune out of the Jalpa? Was everything running ok or just trying something new?

David
 

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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
The reason why I removed the Permatune was:
A guy in germany was desperatly seeking a replacement for his broken box.
He had the engine rebuilt by Instinsky in Stuttgart, but the box was bad...
So I sold him my permatune, I wanted to try out the MSD anyway so this was a win-win situation for both.

I cannot say anything bad on the permatune, it was a good advantage over the stock Bosch box.

I just had an idea this night, perhaps I can find a way around this tacho problem, I'll try it today...
 

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Discussion Starter · #4 · (Edited)
OK, jalpa girls, she's dancing with the tacho, the solution was quite simple...

No tacho adapter nor the tacho terminal of the MSD is used.
Just think and look at the wiring, where does the air pump get the signal from?

Got it? there are two wires from the distributor, one of them works.
Just connect it to the brown tacho wire and your tacho dances with the rpm's...

Problem which needs to be sorted out, does this solution work with all tachos?
Since Fred had to send his tacho to Paolo Alto to have the circuit replacement whereas Steve (not Maman) used a tacho adapter which didn't work on my and Fred's Car...

Any further questions why the bills are so high... just spent another few hours to sort this out...

Raymond
Master of the running MSD's on the ealier Lambos :D :whip:
 

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Raymond,

Can you clear this up a little more?

As you may recall, I have a Crane system, Tach stopped working when I installed it, I then installed the MSD adapter, it seem to work OK for several weeks then just stopped working and has not worked since.

Are you stating that the adapters are not needed?
 

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Discussion Starter · #6 ·
lxmichaels said:
Raymond,
Can you clear this up a little more?
NO, read what I wrote it's very obvious...


lxmichaels said:
Raymond,
Are you stating that the adapters are not needed?
Yep, see first answer...
I cannot say if this is the case for all tachos because it seems there are some differences, it's strange (Lamborghini...) that on Steve's white Jalpa the MSD tach adapter works and on my and Fred's Car it doesn't affect/cure the problem...

The solution I found is cheaper and needs a single wire of 2 inches... :cool:

Again, read my post and then think what wires you have and you will find the answer, I just don't want to write it here. :D :wave:
 

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jalpa tach

My mechanic tried everything under the sun to get the MSD to run the tach from using the tach adapter, researchesed Raymonds wireing diag. and other things ( which I can't recall) and nothing worked. Contacted Palo Alto Spedometer in CA and it was suggested to replace the circut board since it wasn't compatiable with the MSD if the tach was OK which it was after his inspection. Haven't had a problen since. I also contacted MSD tech support and they indicated it should work with the tach adapter. It didn't and they couldn't supply a reason why or have a fix. They indicated we were doing something wrong and not following the instructions. Fred K. '87 Jalpa HLA12366
 

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Hi Fred,

I'm still trying to figure out how to sort this out. It would be nice for it to function properly.

I wonder if there is a simple bench test for the Jaeger tachs (input signal, calibration settings, ect)

Any idea what Palo Alto Speedo might charge for the "update"?

When it warms/dries up around here, I'll try to get out to the garage and sort some wires.

~Larry
 

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Discussion Starter · #9 · (Edited)
OK Guys, I don't want you to stay ignorant.
I just used one of the wires coming from the distributor and connected it to the tacho wire...
One of them is connected also to the air pump driver, the other one which is the braided line worked as a tacho signal.
And it seems to work well, I will take a picture of the connector tomorrow, i've to go to the garage anyway because I pulled out the rpm limiter module while installing the box.

Today the roads got dry and I took the little bull for the first ride with the MSD 6AL, what is immediately feelable is the better throttle response and the less rough running of the engine.
I don't think it has more power but drivability increases enormously. The Permatune was already better than stock but the MSD is one step further.

The Permatune has one big advantage, you install it and you know it will work, since Lonnie makes exact replacement boxes, whereas MSD or Crane produce neutral boxes you have to wire on your own and hope that all works.
That this is not always the case shows the Jalpa, where on one car the MSD works with a tach adapter, another one works with a simple wire and the third had the tacho converted...

My resumee:
If you want a simple plug and play replacement take the permatune, is more expensive to buy than the MSD but works for sure. Install time about one hour.

If you are a home mechanic like me who wants to try out different ways to test some solutions and their performance you can go for a MSD or Crane.
But be aware that his road is full of traps and it might also happen that it's a dead end street...
Install time is like playing bingo, it might be done in 2 hours but can also take 5 hours and sometimes you even have to convert the tacho what costs an additional $200...

In the end it might happen that the MSD setup is more expensive alhough the Permatune costs almost the double price.
The buying price is not the only thing that counts! :wave:


lxmichaels said:
I wonder if there is a simple bench test for the Jaeger tachs (input signal, calibration settings, ect)
~Larry
You can with an Oszilloscope, the tacho normally needs a wave signal of a given voltage level, the MSD do not produce an exact wave signal although they say the opposite.
On the box that was installed on the bulgarian LP500s the Oszilloscope showed a signal like a multiple spark, multiple discharges with a first peak of 32 Volt!!!

Of course the old tacho didn't like this and simply didn't work...

MSD said the box is corrupt although it works fine, now we installed some hardware and the tacho works.
 

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Discussion Starter · #10 · (Edited)
I updated the Ignition page:
http://www.jalpa.ch/Ignition/index.html

I just prepared a new box for a Jalpa:

The box on the left is for a Countach QV and will be installed on Saturday, another box went to Hamburg in Germany where another QV-Owner desparatly awaits it, since his MM is broken.


I can make an offer for the Jalpa Owner who want to install the MSD6 on their car.
I will sell the appropriate mounting plate, connector and instructions to wire the box for $50 plus shipment.
 
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