[Hogdogfatkat]

I could have paid cash but chose to finance. Even went with woodside despite higher rates - but their income verification process is super easy and my income is a bit messy/lots of w2's, 1099's, and LLCs that are losers and winners.

We can get super super technical and prove it's still costing me more for financing, but instead, I will use the simplistic formula behind my decision.

1. Purchase price of $215k
2. ~147k Loan at 12 years on the vehicle at a 8% interest rate
3. Cash in the bank in a liquid savings account earns 4%
4. Payment based on #2 above is paid for each month by the interest earned from #3

Since my payment is paid for by the interest in the bank (not assuming taxes I'll pay on the interest and all the other financial holes we can go down), I figured it was much better to have the cash behind me, and readily available, with the vehicle not costing me out of pocket each month.

Do what works for you. I'm mid 30s and my employment will take a massive hit in economic downturns. Some of the work I do is shielded from downturns but 65% is on the line, meaning I want cash behind me just in case.

 

[Hogdogfatkat]

What car is that?

Looks like a Bugatti

 

[Ohlgren]

What car is that?

Bugatti Veyron

 

[Lee T]

I just saw this discussion listed in my trending posts email. I took a break from work and enjoyed reading all of the comments. I quickly noticed the comments I gave thumbs up received thumbs up from the same members over and over. The comments supporting financing and the YOLO crowd get the thumbs up from their camp. I can only speak from my experience that has worked for me. I haven't borrowed on a car for over 20 years. I haven't borrowed for my business in over 15 years. Ironically, years ago when I felt like I wanted to borrow money for my business there were not any lenders interested and this put a real chip on my shoulder. My business grew and the banks came knocking. I decided I would receive interest, never pay it. I know I could have borrowed money and sped up the growth of my business but I also know I would have not been able to sleep well at night, and that is priceless to me! I paid off my home in 2018 and was told it was not a savvy move. I know 100% of foreclosures happen on houses with mortgages. I also know that if I get tired of not having a mortgage a bank would be eager to lend. So far in five years I haven't missed the mortgage. When I paid off my house I was guaranteed a 6.5% rate of return on my money. I hear folks constantly talking about investing their money in lieu of paying off their house or borrowing for a car to do the same thing. What I never hear about is the RISK! Apparently everyone that invests their money instead of paying cash wins..... Not! This is no different than making investments on margin. Margins calls are up and lots of folks are losing right now. I came from humble beginnings and because of that, I focus on generational wealth. For my situation being "YOLO" years ago would have been too selfish and would have derailed my goals. I think the best part of zero debt and a solid net worth is the generosity and goodwill we spread.

Greatt points. I think the young guys promoting debt have not lived through a loss of income and not being able to pay their bills. I also have no mortgage or personal debt. I do however borrow small amounts (low ratio) for land and building investment ventures. My debt ratio in these is so low that even in a crash, I am still very safe. Lee

 

[Lee T]

Age discussion is interesting to me. I was really conservative about spending money on an exotic when I was younger. Strongly believed in spending cash for a car. Everything else came first.

I was able to comfortably afford my Jalpa, but the cars I really wanted were a little out of my comfortable reach.

At 27, I could have stretched my finances and bought a Lamborghini Miura P400 for $85,000. Didn't do it. At 35, I could have stretched my finances and bought a Countach 5000S for $70,000. Didn't do it.

I don't know if I was smart, or a total idiot!

Chris, you are absolutely right. I vote smart. I also passed up a Countach at 80K because I felt it was a little more than I wanted to spend. Your point of saving and buying the car is what I am trying to pass on to these guys. Saving and earning money for a goal is a very important exercise in becoming wealthy. Buying on credit is immediate gratification with the suffering put into the future. Saving and working towards a goal is a very positive experience. Trying to make large payments and/ or losing a valued asset is a negative experience. If you finance and have the money in investments, that is way better than taking on the pure debt. I would have loved a Lambo at 25 or 30. I bought an old Ferrari at 39. It was still a great achievement to me. In my 20s , I was saddled with debt and eventually went bankrupt. I think most of the older guys are more conservative financially due to many years experience. I wish I could rewind the clock and invest all the money I blew on interest for toys into income earning property. Now, if it does not make money, I dont buy it. (With exception of vacations , charity, gambling and maybe a few beers) I even learned to count cards because I hated to lose at gambling. Vacations were ok because I made more money every time I came back. Charity speaks for itself. I dont have a good reason for the beers yet but maybe.... stress relief. LOL

 

[Lee T]

View attachment 327038
Priorities and choices...

 

[Lee T]

Speaks volumes. LOL

 

[Lee T]

Has anyone ran an age vote/survey before? Would be interesting to see what the demographics are

Excellent Idea. Make 20 to 35, 36 to 50 and 51 Plus.

 

[Buy&Hold]

Chris, you are absolutely right. I vote smart. I also passed up a Countach at 80K because I felt it was a little more than I wanted to spend. Your point of saving and buying the car is what I am trying to pass on to these guys. Saving and earning money for a goal is a very important exercise in becoming wealthy. Buying on credit is immediate gratification with the suffering put into the future. Saving and working towards a goal is a very positive experience. Trying to make large payments and/ or losing a valued asset is a negative experience. If you finance and have the money in investments, that is way better than taking on the pure debt. I would have loved a Lambo at 25 or 30. I bought an old Ferrari at 39. It was still a great achievement to me. In my 20s , I was saddled with debt and eventually went bankrupt. I think most of the older guys are more conservative financially due to many years experience. I wish I could rewind the clock and invest all the money I blew on interest for toys into income earning property. Now, if it does not make money, I dont buy it. (With exception of vacations , charity, gambling and maybe a few beers) I even learned to count cards because I hated to lose at gambling. Vacations were ok because I made more money every time I came back. Charity speaks for itself. I dont have a good reason for the beers yet but maybe.... stress relief. LOL

"Saving and earning money for a goal is a very important exercise in becoming wealthy." I love that!! We live in an immediate gratification country and personal/consumer debt has never been higher. Slow and steady wins the race is a lifestyle that is frowned upon and considered antiquated. But as the quote says, "When the tide goes out, we see who is swimming naked" and then there is "blood in the streets." Paid for property just feels different. The diligence required can be very humbling because inevitably there will be setbacks..... It was so unpopular to invest in my early 20's even the paultry amount I was investing, but it created a longterm habit of investing that has literally paid huge dividends. My two sons are in their 20's and invest monthly. They understand that time in the market is the secret sauce.

 

[Panda]

Times change, markets change, risk profiles change and social media spreads good and bad information. Saving isn't a bad idea at all. I think everyone should save a minimum before making some yolo moves or investments. I know people that did this and lost, as well as others that immediately went into hardcore loan debt for businesses or gambles and won.

There is no best answer for every single person. Just depends on a blend of finances, age, risk appetite and what you want in life.

You're right, in the real world money talks. Doesn't matter if from you or the bank or the CU you're using, it's still money at the end of the day leveraged and borrowed in this financial system we have. A great example of money talking is also no one wanting to do business with you until you had money. Now one could argue under the assumption you never reinvested those monies that you've left a lot on the table. Too many what ifs and rabbit holes.

Just don't be in camp D, but if you are, make social media posts when it blows up so we can learn, lol.

 

[jimmy-j]

I made a google form for demographics, feel free to fill it out. All the questions are optional and the data is public (you can view responses without filling it out as well) so don't input anything you don't want others to see.

Lamborghini Talk Demographics

Answers are anonymous (unless you choose to input your info, be aware this data will be made public) This is not official in any way All questions are optional. Thanks!

docs.google.com

Let me know if there are any questions that should be added

 

[Hogdogfatkat]

I made a google form for demographics, feel free to fill it out. All the questions are optional and the data is public (you can view responses without filling it out as well) so don't input anything you don't want others to see.

Lamborghini Talk Demographics

Answers are anonymous (unless you choose to input your info, be aware this data will be made public) This is not official in any way All questions are optional. Thanks!

docs.google.com

Let me know if there are any questions that should be added

Add something about financing or paying cash

 

[jimmy-j]

Add something about financing or paying cash

Just added it

 

[Lee T]

"Saving and earning money for a goal is a very important exercise in becoming wealthy." I love that!! We live in an immediate gratification country and personal/consumer debt has never been higher. Slow and steady wins the race is a lifestyle that is frowned upon and considered antiquated. But as the quote says, "When the tide goes out, we see who is swimming naked" and then there is "blood in the streets." Paid for property just feels different. The diligence required can be very humbling because inevitably there will be setbacks..... It was so unpopular to invest in my early 20's even the paultry amount I was investing, but it created a longterm habit of investing that has literally paid huge dividends. My two sons are in their 20's and invest monthly. They understand that time in the market is the secret sauce.

Wonderful point. Is it better to be rich in a few years or look rich now? Many small businesses sell to foreigners. Why? They are the only ones with cash. They save their money and then buy a business. How many convenience stores do you see run by American Guys? Damn few. Saving , building assets and net worth opens many doors to opportunity. I make great deals all the time because I CAN. You have done the same. KUDOS brother.

 

[Lee T]

You might separate the pay cash and finance into regular cars and toys. I always pay cash for toys like the lambos but sometimes finance part of business assets. Especially when interest is almost free.

 

[Buy&Hold]

Wonderful point. Is it better to be rich in a few years or look rich now? Many small businesses sell to foreigners. Why? They are the only ones with cash. They save their money and then buy a business. How many convenience stores do you see run by American Guys? Damn few. Saving , building assets and net worth opens many doors to opportunity. I make great deals all the time because I CAN. You have done the same. KUDOS brother.

I think we are cut from the same cloth. 🤣 Sometimes I push to hard looking for the next opportunity. I learned a long time ago that is a mistake. When I start pressing, I fall back on this Munger quote....

What Munger Actually Said

"Another thing you have to do, of course, is to have a lot of assiduity. I like that word because it means: sit down on your ass until you do it."

 

[westcoastmurci]

I made a google form for demographics, feel free to fill it out. All the questions are optional and the data is public (you can view responses without filling it out as well) so don't input anything you don't want others to see.

Lamborghini Talk Demographics

Answers are anonymous (unless you choose to input your info, be aware this data will be made public) This is not official in any way All questions are optional. Thanks!

docs.google.com

Let me know if there are any questions that should be added

When would you post the results to the poll in a month or so time?

 

[jimmy-j]

When would you post the results to the poll in a month or so time?

Anyone can see the results of the poll through the link (you may have to press submit to get the option, but you don't have to input anything in the form to do so)

If we get a decent amount of results I may whip up some quick charts as well. I'll probably post this in its own thread some time too to gather more data.

 

[DXM31]

View attachment 327038
Priorities and choices...

Nice but it is a fake, it started out as a Mitsubishi I think. I've seen several pics of this car on Reddit.

 

[DXM31]

The age part of this discussion is an interesting development. When I was in my 30's I couldn't spend money fast enough. The majority of which was racecar and racecar related stuff. You can't finance that. Now in my 60's and I guess I just never got into the whole making payments on stuff. I heard a comic say "If you can't buy something three times, you don't need it". Which also explains why I don't have a Pagani.